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Hey Robb, what's your go-to Weird Al song?

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Uh, it’s “Everything You Know Is Wrong.”

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And uh, would you strip to it?

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Who says I have it?

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[Music]

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Well, hello, and welcome to the Indie Film Lodge, a podcast about the nuts and bolts of independent filmmaking from the bottom up. I'm Robb Padgett.

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And I'm Matt Jackson and today we're talking about discovery.

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Because even with the best laid plan, sometimes the real magic lies in the connections you don't intend.

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And being open to it could reveal what your movie is actually about.

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And to be our narrative Sherpas today are our guests Jeff Nucera and Jonathan Ruane, who made the fun and empowering documentary Tight & Nerdy.

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And we're gonna be, uh, this be a bunch of guys talking about female empowerment today.

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Like God intended, hey fellas.

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Hello.

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I've never been a Sherpa before.

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Uh, I'm sorry you cited about it.

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You need a special certification, but I'm sure you can get it.

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Yeah, you anybody can go be a Sherpa now.

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I heard that the pee on Mount Everest is melting the glaciers so great.

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Yeah, pretty soon you're just be able to walk right up.

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[Laughter]

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I'm ready.

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I have a full bladder and a backpack.

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[Laughter]

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Off to a great start, guys.

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[Laughter]

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Uh, empowerment.

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So guys, tell us, and everybody listening, uh, what is Tight & Nerdy?

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Tight & Nerdy is the, uh, it’s a feature-length documentary about the world’s first and only burlesque troupe dedicated to the music of “Weird Al” Yankovic.

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Did I get that right, Jonathan?

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Yes, you did.

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Okay.

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I find that hard to believe, because I mean, burlesque and Weird Al, I mean, makes sense to me.

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It does.

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Um, you know, troupes that do like one-off nights here and there, just like a special evening with Weird Al songs, but this troupe gathers and travels, and this is what they do.

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Tight & Nerdy is the troupe name.

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Tight & Nerdy is the doc name.

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Tight & Nerdy is our mantra.

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[Laughter]

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It's not our original dock name though, so.

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Also true, yes.

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Yeah, so, uh, I know what the original dock name is.

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Showgals. What, uh, what forced the change of the show—

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Name.

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The name of the producer.

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It strongly suggested it in the post process.

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Uh, that.

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At least Smith, in case you know Eddie Schmidt.

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Uh, I don't know Eddie Schmidt.

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Okay.

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We worked in the same building as Eddie Schmidt.

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Oh, in the same crummy building or the better crummy building?

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Uh, the, uh, the Gigolos building.

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Oh, got it.

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Yeah, yeah, the better, the better crummy building.

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Yes.

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He is an amazing documentary producer and Weird Al superfan, and he came on to help guide us through the post process.

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And one of his very helpful pieces of guidance was, “Hey, people may not, if they hear the word Showgals, quite understand what your movie is about, whereas Tight & Nerdy, because that’s the name of the troupe, is right there.”

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Like, perhaps that is a better title.

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Sure.

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It's fun.

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Yeah.

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Showgals, you sort of had to—we had, like, this, you know, Al was highlighted in the graphic design.

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And, uh, exactly yes, if you're not staring at it like we are all the time, it doesn't make any sense.

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Sure.

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Yeah, plus there’s no association to that horrible movie from the ’90s.

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Exactly.

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I personally love that movie.

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And so, uh, and we were inspired by it.

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Yeah.

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Which is, which is actually a phenomenal transition into my next question.

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So, give me three inspirations you had for this movie. Like, did you watch something to get the right headspace, or what inspired the journey to show off this Tight & Nerdy?

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Well, I believe—was I the first one who forced you, Jeff, to watch Showgirls?

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Yeah.

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Oh, yes.

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Yes.

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So, and that was in early on in our friendship.

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Yes.

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So I think we laid the groundwork back in the early 2000s by me forcing Jeff to watch Showgirls and him still being friends with me afterwards.

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He enjoyed it as much as I do.

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So, it's a long con.

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Yes.

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And then I tricked Jonathan into working on this movie.

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I was like, hey, what do you think about this? He's like, yes.

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Jeff, I know that you come from reality Jonathan.

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Do you come from reality too?

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I come from reality and documentary.

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And, funnily enough, post us starting to make this movie,

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it’s now my full-time job. I work as a story producer, co-producer for feature documentaries.

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Oh my gosh.

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I worked on the Billie Eilish: The World’s a Little Blurry documentary for Apple.

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Oh.

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The Martha Stewart documentary for Netflix.

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We’re just wrapping up the Julie Andrews documentary for Disney+, which is very exciting.

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So, I am very lucky.

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My first job in L.A. was working for documentary filmmaker R. J. Cutler, who also made reality and nonfiction television.

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And it's my longest relationship in LA.

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I've known him even longer than I've known Jeff.

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Of course.

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So, I came back and worked and started working with him back in 2017-2018.

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And while we've been making this movie on this side, I've been doing feature docs for real too.

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So, this is now for real somehow.

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That's what's so amazing is we've been doing this on this side for a hobby essentially.

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And it's very expensive, very long, very sad hobby.

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I mean, that's, that's, that's, that's in a bit of filmmaking for you, right?

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It's like, very long, very expensive, not a good prize at the very end.

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It's great.

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Although, I don't, I don't, they've been lucky enough.

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I mean, unbelievably, we've won awards at film festivals, which is just, I mean, probably one of the more unexpected things that has happened on our film.

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And turning—’cause, like, I mean, a movie about Weird Al burlesque dancers, you don’t think, you know, a festival awards darling.

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So, until you see it and it's wonderful.

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I was laughing the entire time, was watching here in the office.

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My wife was sitting behind me and she's like, what are you watching?

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She'd look over and see naked ladies like gyrating around and then I was, you know, laugh at something.

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She's like, what is going on?

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Very confused.

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And she knew it was legitimate because you didn't immediately close the laptop.

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Exactly.

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What? I wasn't watching anything.

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I didn't see an ad, I think.

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Yeah, what are you watching? I don't know what you're doing.

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But, but so, was there any other things that you pointed to?

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Like, this is what we wanted to feel like, or this is like a North Star as you’re going, or just Showgirls, not Showgirls?

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Was it just Showgirls and the general vibe of making a doc?

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Some films that—I mean, like Bathtubs Over Broadway, for example, just like this niche fandom that comes out of nowhere.

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You're not really sure why anyone's clinging to it, but they're getting something out of it.

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Like, that is this.

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That is this.

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That's the one that's about the corporate musicals.

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There it is. Corporate musicals are on like 45s or something, right?

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They're on LPs, but yes.

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It's amazing, doc, and if people have not watched, I highly recommend.

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It's so fun.

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Yeah.

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I mean, the other one I just watched when we are starting this process was this movie called Finders Keepers.

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Which is right.

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Which and I literally when our camera person on the first initial interview, I was like,

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"Look at the way these interviews are shot because they're amazing."

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And so that kind of was one of the things that guided us.

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And that documentary is almost impossible to describe, but it is about two men,

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one of whom loses his leg and the other man acquires the leg and then doesn't want to give that leg back.

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What does the man do with the third leg?

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I mean, you gotta watch the movie.

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No spoilers.

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People ask me that all the time.

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That's awesome.

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That's awesome.

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I have to check this out.

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I've heard of Bathtubs Over Broadway, but I've never seen it.

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And now Finders Keepers is, like, right up at the top of the list for me, because holy shit, that sounds amazing.

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He's worth checking out for sure.

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So beyond inspiration.

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Yeah.

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Thank you.

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So beyond inspiration.

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Movies rarely just appear in front of us, right?

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There’s always a big journey from, like, the initial idea, the initial screening of Showgirls to, you know, making an actual movie.

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I always feel like there's three parts of making a movie.

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There's the obsession part.

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Like, if you started, there's the pivot part where you realize things are wrong and you gotta change tactics.

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And then there's the miracle part where something happens that you didn't expect that really makes it sing.

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So my first question is for you is what was the thing that made you obsessed about making this movie about?

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Weird Al Burlesque dancers.

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My obsession probably goes back to childhood when I became obsessed with Weird Al and his music and his mania, and then flash forward to living in L.A. a thousand years later and going to see the troupe perform and just being blown away by them and having the leader of the troupe, Pickles Kintaro, reach out to me after I saw them a couple times.

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And she just was, I mean, literally it was like, do you think there's a film here, a documentary here?

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And then I ran over to Jonathan and said, hey, we have this person who might be a story.

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And I was like, as a fan of the movie Showgirls, and I just watched Finders Keepers, I was like, “I someday want to make a movie like that.”

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And I was like, here we go. Let's go.

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And so one of Vendee, really?

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And so we, I mean, Jeff and I originally met when he was going to work at Weird Al's Museum at the Orange County Fair.

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The Weird Al Experience in 2002.

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Wow.

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And so we met out through mutual friends and then he saw me on the street like the day before he was going pulled over and tried to convince me to go go down to Orange County to see this Weird Al exhibit.

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I was like, I'm about to go live at the Orange County Fair for a month. Someone please come visit me.

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And your stranger danger alarm didn't go off that this strange man was going to be homeless living at the County Fair.

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And while he clearly was a Kenjo spirit, like we, I did not go to the Orange County Fair to go see it.

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And yet despite that, we became friends after he came back.

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I'm just like a month, a month down there.

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Yeah, I was, I was gone for like four weeks.

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I wish, was it worth it? I went insane.

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You had a full experience.

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Yeah.

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And yeah, so anyway, our friendship was built on the Weird Al connection.

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And so like the idea was after he pitched the idea to me, we're like, let's go film interviews with these women to see if there's something there.

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And so we were both working on Iyanla: Fix My Life at the time.

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And we recruited a fellow coworker Ralph Churchill to film these interviews.

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And we went up to San Francisco and filmed interviews with these four women.

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And I mean, almost right away it was like, oh, there's something here.

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These women are amazing, fascinating.

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They pop on camera.

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Like they're wonderful. Yeah.

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They're so, they're so emotionally open. Like their back stories are tragic and beautiful and so ripe for story tell.

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It was, it was incredible.

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And I mean, a lot of the, that initial interviews are in our final film.

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Even though we followed them for years, it is a tribute to Jeff's early producing work.

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He spoke with all these women.

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I mean, it was pre-Zoom. Was that Skype calls, Jeff?

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Yeah, we did some Skypes.

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He did Skypes with pre-interviews with these women and preparing them for the kind of questions we were asking.

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And so by the time we even got there, they were ready to go and to share their story.

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That's amazing. That's so cool.

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And so you don't have any other connection with them besides you saw the show and you're like, this could be a thing.

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That is so magical.

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Saw the show loved it. I mean, they clearly were putting up ton of work into this thing.

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And loved the music. Like I love the music. And I just connected with it, you know?

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Do they love it the same way you love it? I feel like there's a deeper connection.

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Not lunch, Lasagna.

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No offense. No offense.

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I don't know.

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Maybe you are a burlesque dancer and you just haven’t told me yet, which would be great.

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You don't know what happens in my head.

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The sequel involves Jeff becoming the last showgal.

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Yeah.

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You started firing up any minute now.

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So okay, well, you know, every production starts with the best intentions.

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Plans rarely go off without a hitch.

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I'm sure you guys ran into some hitches.

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What was the major pivot you had to make while shooting the movie?

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Like what happened and why?

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If you had one, I mean, maybe you did go off without a hitch.

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The movie came out very smooth.

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There were so many hitches along the way.

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There were still hitches somehow.

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I mean, Jeff, which hitch did you want to...

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I mean, music was a hitch.

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For sure.

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A hitch and a half.

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Yeah.

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You know, Weird Al's team and Weird Al himself, of course, were all very kind and very helpful.

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Al does not own the rights to the parodies though.

230
00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:36,000
Oh.

231
00:13:36,000 --> 00:13:42,000
He co-wrote the parodies, but we have to go through the original songwriter,

232
00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:48,000
Slash singer, slash performer, slash management, slash lawyers, slash whoever those people are.

233
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:49,000
Songwriters.

234
00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:51,000
To get them to sign off.

235
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:58,000
And luckily, we had a great music supervisor who just made this as easy as possible and it was not easy.

236
00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,000
But there are some songs that are missing.

237
00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:01,000
Yes.

238
00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:03,000
And it bums me out.

239
00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:09,000
Every time we watch it, I'm like, "There's some songs that I was like, 'Oh, this is kind of like this other song.'

240
00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,000
But not before."

241
00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:15,000
I mean, there's one specifically in the movie, no spoilers, that it's clear that it's not.

242
00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,000
You know, we did our best.

243
00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:23,000
I mean, the other thing that happened was we got into our first film festival and we were not locked.

244
00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:24,000
Done.

245
00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:25,000
We were locked.

246
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:27,000
And so we were close.

247
00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:28,000
Yeah.

248
00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:29,000
And so there was...

249
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:34,000
But we were still like holding on hope. We're like, "Oh, we'll just keep bugging them until they give up."

250
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,000
And then it was like, "Oh, we have to get this."

251
00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:37,000
We have to get this done.

252
00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:38,000
And then...

253
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:39,000
In like two weeks.

254
00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:43,000
And then we finally got final nos on a couple of songs in the film.

255
00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:46,000
And so we had to pivot a few times.

256
00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:51,000
Like “Spam,” which is a song that Pearl E. Gates performs to in the movie,

257
00:14:51,000 --> 00:14:55,000
that originally started the movie, that opened the movie.

258
00:14:55,000 --> 00:15:00,000
And then because of the other song, we had filmed her performing too.

259
00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:01,000
Did not clear.

260
00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:05,000
The original songwriter did not give us permission, said, "No, thank you."

261
00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:14,000
And so we shifted a few things around to make that kind of the first big performance you see from Pearl E. Gates in the movie.

262
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:19,000
And then we had already Shenzhen, his amazing supervisor, had cleared...

263
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:23,000
“I Think I’m a Clone Now” for a smaller moment in the movie.

264
00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,000
And we're like, "Well, those songwriters gave us permission.

265
00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:28,000
Maybe we can shift that to the top of the movie."

266
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:32,000
And so we were able to go back to them and they gave us permission to use a longer part of the song.

267
00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,000
And that's how the open of the movie became what it is.

268
00:15:35,000 --> 00:15:44,000
So we were able to kind of shift things around and make that work in the final weeks before we had to lock picture and deliver it to the Heartland Film Festival, which is where we premiered.

269
00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:45,000
Wow.

270
00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:50,000
Yeah, I heard that music and I was thinking that exact same thing, because licensing can be a bear.

271
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:53,000
So it was like, "Because Weird Al doesn't have the songs."

272
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:58,000
At one point you play my favorite song, which I said at the beginning of the movie, “Everything You Know Is Wrong.”

273
00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:06,000
You play the music to that, but you don't play the lyrics to that. But because Weird Al wrote that song, you know, you were able to do that kind of thing.

274
00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,000
You can't just play the karaoke version of the other songs.

275
00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:10,000
Right, exactly.

276
00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:18,000
And Al’s team, again, they were so kind in letting us use Al’s original songs as our score in a lot of places.

277
00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:24,000
And I think it elevates the film and makes it feel like a Weird Al homage, which it is.

278
00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:33,000
But we also had a fantastic singer-songwriter, Summer Woods, do some covers of Al’s original songs, which I just...

279
00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:35,000
I love her so much. Her songs are amazing.

280
00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:44,000
She plays like 2000 instruments or something crazy, and just is a musical genius, like in every sense of the word.

281
00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:47,000
And she really just took care of us.

282
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:52,000
That's great. I was watching the credit song, which I loved.

283
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:57,000
And I was like, it took me a minute to clue into all this happening. I was like, what is this song?

284
00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:01,000
And I had to go back to look. I was like, this is written my Weird Al.

285
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,000
I was like, is this an original song? And I just wrote it was done.

286
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,000
You have to watch the fake documentary.

287
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:07,000
Yes, indeed.

288
00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:13,000
But she was great. She, like, her covers of those songs really give it a nice vibe.

289
00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,000
That was a COVID discovery by Jeff, right?

290
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:24,000
Yeah. Oh, yeah. She, during COVID, just started performing these piano-based medleys of Al original songs.

291
00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:27,000
And I was like, that's what we need. That's exactly what we need. She's right here.

292
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:30,000
She's like, in Pasadena, how did that happen?

293
00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:31,000
Nice.

294
00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:37,000
Well, I guess how big of a problem was COVID for you guys.

295
00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:41,000
Because I don't remember when you started shooting, but I know.

296
00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:46,000
I know. But I could tell by the footage that it was not post-COVID, because I saw no masks.

297
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:55,000
Yeah, it was pre-COVID. Most of it was pre-COVID. I mean, COVID happened and it was just we were in post.

298
00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:56,000
Oh, yeah.

299
00:17:56,000 --> 00:18:08,000
And we, just the editing process was a big lift. And we finally did a Kickstarter to fundraise to pay an editor to actually edit our movie together.

300
00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:12,000
Yes, Candace Kregg, who saved our lives many times.

301
00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:17,000
If only you guys knew editors who could edit reality or documentary.

302
00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:21,000
Yes. She was an editor who we worked with on Iyanla: Fix My Life.

303
00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:27,000
And so we met her through that show when she was fantastic and could have asked her material.

304
00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:32,000
And yeah, like in the middle of it, she moved to Portugal. She moved her up and moved to family to Portugal.

305
00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:41,000
So the last half of the edit was being done remotely. Literally just like, here's a drive. Bye. Bye.

306
00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:42,000
Wow.

307
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:44,000
Real international production. Yes.

308
00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,000
Yes.

309
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:50,000
Well, she did a great job because that's why I've stayed away from reality and documentary as an editor.

310
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,000
It's just the lift is too heavy.

311
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:58,000
I like having a little script that tells me what people are going to say.

312
00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:03,000
We gave her an outline that was almost accurate sometimes.

313
00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:05,000
I don't know. I did too much reality.

314
00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:09,000
So I even wanted to edit stuff that I've shot with a plan.

315
00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:14,000
I'm always like, oh, but I could mix and match these lines or cut this up.

316
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:19,000
I shot some terrible footage of me in New York.

317
00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,000
And I let it sit for 10 years.

318
00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:25,000
And when I finally sat down to pick it back up again, I had all these reality tricks.

319
00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:30,000
And it was like, it’s great, like creating new meanings out of things.

320
00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:33,000
It is the absolute best. Robb, you’re missing out.

321
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:37,000
Well, there is that aspect in narrative.

322
00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:38,000
I'm so old.

323
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:42,000
In narrative stuff, they never quite get what they want.

324
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,000
But the blueprint is there for what they were intending.

325
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:50,000
So when they're really wrong, you're like, how do I make it kind of what they wanted?

326
00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:53,000
And if I can't, then I can't. I'll just do something else.

327
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,000
The secret is that is all reality.

328
00:19:56,000 --> 00:19:59,000
That's all probably all documentary is like, everyone goes in with a plan.

329
00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:03,000
It's like Mike Tyson. You go in with a plan and then everyone gets punched in the face

330
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,000
and you gotta like figure it out.

331
00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:09,000
And it's tough, you know, to be open and whatever.

332
00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:11,000
We're going to talk about that in a minute.

333
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:15,000
But before I start talking about discovery and the joys of putting the pieces together,

334
00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:20,000
I do want to ask you guys about the last piece of our OPM is the miracle.

335
00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:23,000
What was the miracle that happened in this movie?

336
00:20:23,000 --> 00:20:25,000
The talent fell in your lap.

337
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:26,000
It was great.

338
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,000
Weird Al was very amenable to doing things.

339
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,000
Weird Al was certainly one of the miracles of this.

340
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:36,000
Just reaching out to him and asking if he would be a part of it, asking if we could even like proceed with this.

341
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:41,000
And him just being super like into it and being like, yep, absolutely.

342
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:47,000
That was miracle number one because, boy, that was the scariest email I ever had to write.

343
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:53,000
Whenever Jeff has to reach out to Al like about this, he always panic.

344
00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,000
Yeah, I get it.

345
00:20:56,000 --> 00:21:00,000
You know, certain people and you just you want them to know that you respect them as a person.

346
00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:04,000
You don’t want things from them, and then you want something, and you’re like, “Oh, I gotta ask.”

347
00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,000
I don't know what he says.

348
00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:10,000
If he says no, then we're doing a big pivot.

349
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:14,000
I mean, he got in a bit like the fact that he agreed to an on camera interview,

350
00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,000
which by the way, he showed up early to what's amazing.

351
00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:22,000
Like, yeah, I mean, it's unheard of for like talent to show up early to something and we were all like, ah, you know,

352
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,000
it's a surprise, but it's not ready.

353
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:25,000
Oh, God.

354
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:26,000
He was ready.

355
00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,000
He came ready to go fully prepared.

356
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:31,000
Oh, what a what a pro.

357
00:21:31,000 --> 00:21:33,000
What a nice, awesome human.

358
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:36,000
Everything you hear about him is true, of course.

359
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:41,000
But he just is such a pro and came fully ready.

360
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:49,000
And it was again a terrifying day on in my life, my professional life, my real life.

361
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:53,000
And he gives you something in those interviews that really helps propel the story.

362
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,000
You know what I mean?

363
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:55,000
He's not just like telling you.

364
00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:56,000
He's not by rote.

365
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:59,000
He's like, he seems to really want this to succeed.

366
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,000
Like, the story to be told, the women to succeed and what they're doing.

367
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:03,000
He's very optimistic.

368
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:04,000
He is.

369
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:05,000
And he's such a great.

370
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:10,000
He's got great energy and we took us a while to figure out how we were going to kind of sew those interviews.

371
00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:16,000
And then might also be one of the miracles of just figuring out how those play worked.

372
00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:18,000
It really does work well.

373
00:22:18,000 --> 00:22:23,000
I would say the revelation was when we were editing like a sales tape.

374
00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:28,000
And Al does the line about, oh, now we're getting to deep stuff transition.

375
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,000
Use that in the sales tape.

376
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:38,000
And that I think was the kind of key to understanding how to use Al's interview in the movie.

377
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,000
As like a chapter heading basically.

378
00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:44,000
Yeah, because he's, it almost feels like he's driving it in some way because of the way you cut it.

379
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,000
Yeah.

380
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:46,000
Yeah.

381
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:47,000
Yeah, again, Candace Kregg’s amazing work.

382
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:48,000
Yeah.

383
00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:52,000
I do have another miracle if you if you'll indulge me.

384
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:53,000
This is a one miracle show.

385
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:54,000
Oh, sorry.

386
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,000
Give it to us.

387
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:57,000
What do you got?

388
00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:58,000
What do you got?

389
00:22:58,000 --> 00:22:59,000
It better be better.

390
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:00,000
Really good.

391
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,000
We were interviewing Odessa Lil really early on.

392
00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:05,000
I think it was our first interview with her.

393
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:06,000
Yeah.

394
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:12,000
And Jonathan picked up on this thing she said that I, you know, listen, I really like interviewing people.

395
00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:18,000
And I like listening and trying to like follow a plan or follow a conversation.

396
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,000
And I didn't pick up on this.

397
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:25,000
And Jonathan, 100% keyed in on it and we were wrapping up and he goes, wait a minute.

398
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:30,000
You just said you're the only, you grew up as the only Jew in Fresno.

399
00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:38,000
And that got us into some of the like real powerful storytelling that she gives us.

400
00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:40,000
Because Jonathan just followed that.

401
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:45,000
Well, I mean, it was also out of personal experience because I grew up one of the only Jewish people in my hometown.

402
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:50,000
And so there was something about that that I was like, I know what that's like.

403
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,000
Can you unpack that a bit more?

404
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:57,000
And that led to kind of her talking about her family history.

405
00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:06,000
And like what that was like and feeling like, you know, an outcast and how much that affected her and affected how she was raised.

406
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:12,000
Oh, that's that's incredible because it gave so much depth to her.

407
00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:13,000
Yeah.

408
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,000
But again, I like not necessarily my insight.

409
00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,000
It was only because I had had a similar experience.

410
00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,000
Did it prompt me to be like, wait a minute, let's talk about that more.

411
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:36,000
And so that's what like, but that was the connection with these women that we had very early on was there is a similar shared experience of growing up feeling like an outsider, like feeling like I haven't found my people yet.

412
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:36,000
Right.

413
00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:40,000
And that message came through pretty quickly.

414
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:43,000
And that ultimately I think is the message of our movie.

415
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:43,000
Absolutely.

416
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,000
Which is it, which is a good again, transition.

417
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:51,000
And John, we're going to hire you on the show just to be our transition guy because you're fucking great at it.

418
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,000
You're the Weird Al of this show.

419
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,000
Yeah.

420
00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:58,000
I used to have Weird Al hair, but I cut it recently.

421
00:24:58,000 --> 00:24:59,000
It's a damn shame.

422
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:01,000
You need to let it go.

423
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,000
I have a Weird Al pinball machine in my house.

424
00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:11,000
And when his son, when Jonathan's son was was younger, there's a picture of out like a cartoon owl.

425
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:16,000
There was crazy hair. And his son came over and was like, “That’s Daddy.”

426
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,000
[laughter]

427
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:25,000
But so we're talking about the thing we I wanted to bring you on to talk about.

428
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:30,000
I mean, not just the show. Tight & Nerdy is, I keep saying show because I'm such a professional.

429
00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:31,000
That's a show.

430
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:32,000
I know. It's everything to show.

431
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,000
But we're here to talk about the movie.

432
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,000
Tight & Nerdy.

433
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:40,000
And the thing about documentary filmmaking is that level of discovery.

434
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:45,000
Like actively listening and pulling things out, having a plan and being okay with finding new pathways.

435
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:53,000
And so you mentioned this, but when you started and you're like, oh, this will be a fun movie about this burlesque troupe.

436
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:57,000
At what point did it become about female empowerment, which is awesome.

437
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:03,000
Like, did you go into it thinking that, or did that come out of Pickles, or did that happen when you interviewed Odessa Lil?

438
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,000
No.

439
00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:07,000
[laughter]

440
00:26:07,000 --> 00:26:16,000
No, we did not go in with a plan, with themes, with anything. It was just sort of like, oh, this is like a fun weird thing that these women are doing.

441
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:20,000
And you know, certainly early on, we were like, oh, it'll be a fun little short dock.

442
00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:31,000
And you know, the more we sort of picked at these stories, we were like, oh my god, there's something like actually here that connects these that's bigger than we thought.

443
00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:44,000
And I don't know when the turn occurred, but it was sometime after that, that first show we shot, where it was like, oh, there's something really special here that is more than just a comedy silly show.

444
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:48,000
There is feelings, there's art, there's family here.

445
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:56,000
I mean, Pickle talks about like, did an ornithial interview. Like, she's not doing this, none of these women are doing it for money.

446
00:26:56,000 --> 00:27:09,000
They are doing it out of a love of burlesque and a love of owl and a love of wanting to express themselves in a like creative way.

447
00:27:09,000 --> 00:27:25,000
I think Perly Gates's story about how she came to burlesque and what it means to her was pretty informative as to our understanding of why would you get on stage and take your clothes off to weird outsocks.

448
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:35,000
What is that about? Like, that was a question we had early on and female empowerment and expressing yourself in a creative way in front of an audience is where we got to.

449
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:36,000
Yeah, right.

450
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:41,000
When we speak to these women, they are fully empowered. They are choosing to be on stage.

451
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:46,000
They are very proud of themselves as they should be because they are gorgeous inside and out.

452
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:58,000
And they are just so inspiring to so many people. We—Jonathan and I were at—the women performed at SF Sketchfest last year, this year.

453
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:10,000
I don't know at some point. And afterwards this woman who was probably in her late 50s or early 60s ran up to them, just sobbing and she was like, this is so inspiring.

454
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:22,000
I want to do this now and we were like, what is happening? This is crazy. And every time we screen someone in that audience is like, I want to do this.

455
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:26,000
It's so cool. It's so cool to see.

456
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:31,000
Well, because we all want to be brave and there takes a lot of bravery to do burlesque.

457
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,000
It takes bravery to perform at all, but burlesque especially.

458
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,000
Yeah, you’re baring it all.

459
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:37,000
Yeah, literally.

460
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:47,000
So as you are shooting this, how many rounds of interviews did you do? I don't know a lot of people know this about how you make things in Docker or whatever.

461
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:54,000
But a lot of times you do your initial interviews and then you put those together or missing these pieces and you do pickups and more pickups and more pickups.

462
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:58,000
So how many rounds of pickups did you guys do? And at what point did you really start how did you do this?

463
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:03,000
And how open was the cast to your personal questions? Were they always super open or were they?

464
00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:15,000
They were very open. I mean, we got very lucky with this cast. They were super open. When Jonathan and I showed them the film for the very first time, again, terrifying.

465
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:19,000
One of the most stressful moments of this process.

466
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:25,000
Because we were fully prepared for, I can't, you can't show this. This is really terrible, whatever.

467
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:35,000
And I think the only comment was from Odessa, Jonathan, who said something like, I can't believe how open I was.

468
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:41,000
Because they're now seeing this thing five, six, seven years later.

469
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:42,000
Oh, sure.

470
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:49,000
After our initial set of interviews. And so she was like, I can't believe how open I was. And we were like, is.

471
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:57,000
Absolutely. Yeah. They didn't have any notes, which was amazing. Like, it's great. And kind of unheard of.

472
00:29:57,000 --> 00:30:03,000
That’s why I was—because I would figure you’d get notes from Marla, Marla Spankx, the mysterious Marla Spankx.

473
00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:05,000
Yes, Mistress Marla Spankx.

474
00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:16,000
I mean, she went on a journey, I think, even while we were filming and after. And like, I think by the time we finally showed the documentary to her, she was in a different space.

475
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:23,000
Like, just in life and what, her less meant to her and how she felt about that part of her life.

476
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:31,000
And so she too was happy with all that we showed. And, you know, her mom came to see the movie when we played San Francisco at SF IndieFest.

477
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:36,000
And she loved the movie, which was fantastic. Like, that was wild.

478
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:37,000
Yeah.

479
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:44,000
And I have her there. You know, so especially about how her, her other daughter, who's that we interviewed in the movie, like talks about her mom.

480
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:45,000
So, yeah.

481
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:46,000
That's amazing.

482
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:52,000
Yeah. Marla was interesting, because it's, you know, we sort of learned that trick early on during reality TV.

483
00:30:52,000 --> 00:31:02,000
It’s just like, if something’s not there, you just lean into it. And she was—I mean, she held herself more, you know, close to the vest.

484
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:09,000
And just she, but there's that part of all of us that's like, I'm doing this thing, but I know I don't want to talk about it.

485
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:17,000
And I know it sounds crazy, because she's on camera in a film, but it is this like, it's very personal for her. And I loved that.

486
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:22,000
That was one of the things that struck me actually was how open these women were about not being very open.

487
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:23,000
You know what I mean?

488
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:29,000
Like, there was a, there was sort of a dichotomy there that was fascinating. It's like, I don't like to talk about it, but here it is.

489
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,000
Yeah.

490
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:35,000
So at what point in the process did you interview Al? Was Al early? Was he late?

491
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:45,000
You go into that interview knowing the pieces you needed or did you interview Al and then we interviewed Al in between most of the filming took place in 2017.

492
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:56,000
And so during that run after Minnesota and before the Los Angeles and Oakland shows, which are kind of the final two shows you see in the movie, we interviewed Al.

493
00:31:56,000 --> 00:32:00,000
Yeah, we had not, I don't think we had even started post.

494
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:11,000
Yeah, we had not—we had no idea. We didn’t really start—I mean, we did a sales tape soon after, but we didn’t really start post for real until years later.

495
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:15,000
Sure. The pandemic slowed down. We did, we did dig into it.

496
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,000
Yeah.

497
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:24,000
But that's incredible, because I kept watching it and I didn't realize how much of a counter-cultural icon Weird Al was.

498
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:34,000
It was always Weird Al, he was just a fun guy making Star Wars songs and great polkas. And I didn’t realize the power that he has, which was...

499
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:45,000
I mean, he's been around for so long. The longevity is crazy for a novelty artist especially, but you know, he and his band are so talented and he's so clever and smart and funny.

500
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:56,000
And to your point, there is this counter-culture element to him of like, he's taking on the popular people. He's almost bullying the bullies in a way or just taking them down a notch.

501
00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:57,000
Sure.

502
00:32:57,000 --> 00:33:06,000
Something that like I certainly, you know, as a nerd and a misfit growing up, I looked up to that like, oh my god, look what that guy's doing.

503
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:18,000
And he's having such a moment, like, right, like you were catching him right on that up swing. I don't know, after COVID, I mean, I'm wearing nobody can see, but I'm wearing the t-shirt from his concert tour last year. He went on another one this year.

504
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:23,000
And like, I remember when I was a kid, I listened to Dr. Demento, you know, back in the day.

505
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,000
Yes.

506
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:29,000
I had to go to the third floor of my dad’s house with an antenna out the window so I could get a signal from Pittsburgh.

507
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:39,000
So I could listen to Crackley Dr. Demento and then he kind of faded away and now he's really, he's like back and people are really appreciating what he, what he has to offer.

508
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:44,000
So this counter-culture is actually kind of coming up, it's seeping into actual culture now.

509
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:55,000
It's funny. Our film was in post for a very long time as, you know, when we started, people were like, like, you're going to be doing this for 10 years and I was like, I would rather die.

510
00:33:55,000 --> 00:34:00,000
And that remains true, but now.

511
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:11,000
But Al during that time was doing Weird: The Al Yankovic Story, and they shot it, they went into post, and every time I would see Al, he’s like, “Who’s coming out first?” And I’m like, “You have yours.”

512
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,000
So yours.

513
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:19,000
Yeah, it's so funny because I, I'm so jealous retrospectively, but that's a word.

514
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:32,000
When I was younger, I remember I had Greatest Hits, Volume II, and I fucking loved it.

515
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:42,000
I kept flipping over the tape because I love the, there's a love song, polka in it that I could still sing, like verbatim.

516
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:48,000
And nobody else understands. I'll do it to my wife and she's like, what are you, what are you doing? Those polkas are my favorite.

517
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:54,000
They're so good. But I never, I never had the confidence to own my weirdness.

518
00:34:54,000 --> 00:35:01,000
Like I was student of the month or some nonsense in high school and you had to put in the paper, like what your interests were.

519
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:09,000
And I was so concerned that people would know that I was a weird comic loving guy that I went too far in the other direction.

520
00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:17,000
So I was like, Matt enjoys reading and computers. And I read that as a 17 year old, I was like, that's a cool fucking guy.

521
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,000
And I'm not.

522
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:32,000
And yeah, so I'm jealous that you guys were able to see this. These women were able to see Weird Al and be like, oh, that is an idol that I should build myself towards.

523
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,000
You know, and I think this, I think it's so beautiful.

524
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:42,000
I couldn't help it. I was just like, well, you could help it. I really sort of had no choice.

525
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:46,000
Well, when, when I was a kid, because I'm old, you know, Weird Al was on the radio.

526
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:52,000
So you would just hear Weird Al on the radio. You'd hear a song, go, wait, is this Weird Al or is this Michael Jackson?

527
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:56,000
Which song is about to start? Yes. I mean, I have to hear Weird Al at the roller rink.

528
00:35:56,000 --> 00:36:03,000
Right. He was big in the early 80s, mid 80s. He was. He's iconic. He's still iconic.

529
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:10,000
My very first time going out in West Hollywood when I just come out, I was really uncomfortable still.

530
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:15,000
And my friend took me to Micky’s, which is a video bar in West Hollywood.

531
00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:23,000
And it was like a Sunday afternoon and we walked in and they were playing Weird Al videos on the monitors.

532
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,000
What is this?

533
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:30,000
What a welcome wagon. Right? Yeah. Never seen it since. Never can.

534
00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:34,000
That was like, I've never seen Weird Al videos. What was happening?

535
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:37,000
Well, they say you come in and they're like, oh, this is not the crowd we want.

536
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,000
Just brain pre-arranged. Really.

537
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:43,000
Good. I'm in.

538
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:48,000
A shripper of gayness.

539
00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:54,000
But yeah, so I guess to further talk about the discovery and all this, like how did it work with an editor?

540
00:36:54,000 --> 00:37:00,000
You guys are both story producer types. Were you doing pre-cuts? Were you doing paper cuts? Because you live in 1988.

541
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:08,000
Yeah, let's just assume for a moment that some people in the audience have never ever had an experience with documentaries or reality TV.

542
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,000
Like, what is the process to making one of these things?

543
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:15,000
Well, after we filmed it, you put it away for a few years.

544
00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:19,000
Cry about it. You let it marinate.

545
00:37:19,000 --> 00:37:25,000
You always work. You step away. You step away. You stress about it every single day of your life.

546
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:31,000
Yeah. Then you do a Kickstarter to raise money to pay an editor. Then you convince an editor to come work on the project.

547
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:36,000
And then we started handing...

548
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:48,000
Some of which she was cutting from raw footage, but some of which we would do what are called string-outs where we took the footage and made our selects of what we thought was the most.

549
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:55,000
Yeah, we'd sort of chunk it in order to make it seem like a story that makes sense.

550
00:37:55,000 --> 00:38:02,000
And we would hand it over to her and she would work her magic on it or be like, no, when go back to the wrong act.

551
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:06,000
You're insane. You're insane. Find the right bit.

552
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:13,000
And she would turn around cuts. An original cut of this movie was over three hours long.

553
00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:22,000
We took a long journey to figure out how to get Weird Al’s interviews to work in the movie in a way that felt like it wasn’t disrupting the flow of the story.

554
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:29,000
How the interview bites are working. Jeff had a eureka moment about in terms of the performances.

555
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:36,000
I believe how we incorporate the women's stories into the performances to be revealing.

556
00:38:36,000 --> 00:38:43,000
And as they are revealing themselves on stage, they're saying some revealing things on that interview and finding that balance.

557
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,000
A real part of that process.

558
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:46,000
A real thesis bite.

559
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:48,000
Yes indeed.

560
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,000
Yeah.

561
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,000
Yeah. Jeff and I used to work on Gigolos, the sexy show for Showtime.

562
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:53,000
Yes.

563
00:38:53,000 --> 00:39:03,000
And the big trick of that show was when you have a sex scene because watching a sex scene and having somebody talk about ample breasts or big butts or whatever the hell.

564
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:15,000
Like that was no fun. But to have some kind of weird hook where you can have the performers go off in some weird direction was wave and we're interesting and we're more fun as they talked about something about themselves.

565
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:20,000
And it added a real depth. And it's something that I do every time I work on shows ever since then.

566
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:22,000
I always try to find that thesis bite.

567
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:26,000
Yeah. One of my favorite examples, Christian Patterson and Mike Burke put this together.

568
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:35,000
There was one of our guys was hired by an older woman and he just went off about his grandmother in the lessons she taught him.

569
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:39,000
And I maybe never laughed more on that show.

570
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,000
From that day.

571
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:44,000
That show was so great. I just love it.

572
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:47,000
I, you know, it's still a high watermark for me.

573
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:48,000
That show.

574
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:51,000
It was great. We just trying to get out of the soup.

575
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:52,000
Oh yeah.

576
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,000
It was like, hey Dave, everything. Oh my god.

577
00:39:54,000 --> 00:40:00,000
Anyway, sorry. But so you have these thesis bites as a girls were stripping and revealing themselves or revealing something about themselves.

578
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:06,000
That’s great. Did you have, like—were you carding the whole thing, or were you just kind of slapdash, like, here’s a scene?

579
00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:08,000
Here's a scene like go with God.

580
00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:09,000
Candace.

581
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:13,000
We had an outline. We worked on an outline together that we came up with and handed over to Candace.

582
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:15,000
I haven't looked at it in a long time.

583
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:19,000
I don't know how close it is to what we ultimately ended up with.

584
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:21,000
I'm not sure we ever need to look at that again.

585
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:26,000
But like we definitely found it in the edit.

586
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:34,000
And as we were doosed, it became clear what things are the most important and necessary.

587
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:39,000
I mean, we filmed the women going to see Al get his star on the walk of fame.

588
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:42,000
We thought that might be an interesting way to start the movie.

589
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:46,000
At some point we realized it was kind of besides the point.

590
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:52,000
I got taken out of the movie things like that and like the order of how things play in the movie.

591
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:55,000
We kind of found within the edit of which things to play.

592
00:40:55,000 --> 00:41:01,000
And even in terms of like which performances to do in order of the within the film.

593
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,000
We kind of found that in the edit.

594
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,000
And so that took that took what two, three years.

595
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:10,000
The edit was two or three years long before we kind of arrived where we got to.

596
00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:16,000
And we got it to a good place and that was a fine cut. I'd say it's what we submitted to festivals originally.

597
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:17,000
Yeah.

598
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,000
And then once we got into the heartland, then we really had to be like,

599
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:24,000
okay, we have like three, four weeks to actually finish this movie.

600
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:36,000
And that is when we had this great associate editor, Araleo, who we were able to go sit with because Candace was in Portugal, to sit with to kind of fine-tune it and get it to...

601
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:37,000
Okay, this is picture lock.

602
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:39,000
This is what we want to film to be.

603
00:41:39,000 --> 00:41:43,000
And so you didn’t—you got into Heartland, but you didn’t...

604
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,000
This is going to be a strange question.

605
00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:50,000
You didn't continue to edit the movie after it premiered at Heartland or like it's locked.

606
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:52,000
We're done. Walk away.

607
00:41:52,000 --> 00:41:58,000
I mean, we still, as we mentioned earlier, music licensing continues to be the thorn in our side.

608
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:05,000
And while we did clear it for festival use, there’s an additional cost with making it available for streaming.

609
00:42:05,000 --> 00:42:09,000
Because we're now talking about doing a self-distribution model for online.

610
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,000
And so that gets to be expensive.

611
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:21,000
And so we're working through our options on how maybe to relieve some of the number of sheer number of cues we're using in the film.

612
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:23,000
There's a lot. Yeah, there's a lot of music.

613
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:26,000
And so we may be reducing the number.

614
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,000
We're tweaking. We're tweaking.

615
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:37,000
So there's still tweaks happening before the streaming version will hit the available streamers that we can self distribute to.

616
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:41,000
Yeah, but the story is the story we're not changing the cut.

617
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:43,000
That’s—we’re not changing bites.

618
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,000
That's not going to be a bite or anything like that for sure.

619
00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:48,000
Right. Until until you really get in it, you're like, well, I'm just here.

620
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:57,000
So when it's just, this one dies inside.

621
00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:01,000
We just get just a little bit. That's a little too long on that one.

622
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:06,000
Just a few nips and tucks here and there two years later.

623
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:13,000
The good news is the movie’s playing at festivals and playing with audiences so well, like why mess with that too much?

624
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:15,000
Because I passed it.

625
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,000
Because I must be perfect.

626
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:22,000
Well, it plays it's going to do really well when you finally get the music stuff sorted out.

627
00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:27,000
The streaming thing will do really well. I predict that this movie will do very well.

628
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:32,000
Even self-distribution, you know, even if you don't have any placement, you're paying for whatever.

629
00:43:32,000 --> 00:43:37,000
I don't know what relationships you might have self-distributing, but I predicted it would do very well.

630
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:39,000
Thank you.

631
00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:41,000
That's the hope. That's the dream.

632
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:44,000
Yeah. Yeah. The movie is for the people it's for.

633
00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:51,000
I mean, I know that sounds sort of stupid, but it's the people who want this are going to love it.

634
00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:55,000
And the people who don't care about it also can go fuck themselves. No.

635
00:43:55,000 --> 00:43:58,000
It also helps that it's good, you know?

636
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:01,000
Right. The hook is good. The concept is good. The movie's good.

637
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:02,000
So that's good.

638
00:44:02,000 --> 00:44:09,000
Yeah, and I feel like, you know, the idea of making something for everybody, it just makes things really bland.

639
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:13,000
Like, I enjoy the celebration of the counter-culture.

640
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:17,000
I go on this rant every once in a while where I get really bothered with the modern.

641
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:21,000
The modern world and how everything is just fucking samey all the time.

642
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:25,000
And there's no like, it's not that there's no culture.

643
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:31,000
It's both like, there's no monoculture and there's, and everything's just flat and dull.

644
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:38,000
And I love things that delve into little pockets of counter-culture, like little pockets of subcultures that used to get play.

645
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:43,000
And used to be fun to discover, but then the internet, like all things destroyed how that works.

646
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:44,000
Yes.

647
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:51,000
It's like a cultural suburbia, like a sprawl, cultural sprawl, just kind of flattens out.

648
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:56,000
And the houses are similar-ish. They're not too samey, but they're not too different either.

649
00:44:56,000 --> 00:45:00,000
But then you go in those basements and who knows what you’re gonna find?

650
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:04,000
Yeah, naked women dancing to weird music.

651
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:09,000
So guys, this has been wonderful. I have a couple of final questions for you.

652
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:13,000
Unless Rob, you have other final questions before I dive into it.

653
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,000
I don't know. I have no questions. I know all now.

654
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:21,000
Unless you guys have some kind of nugget you want to drop on me before I drop into my final question.

655
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,000
I did write a poem. No.

656
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:32,000
So now that you're at the end of the road, so to speak, I know that you're still dealing with the music, licensing and all that.

657
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:40,000
But if you were able to go back in time, it's 20, what, 20, 2002 when you started this process.

658
00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:51,000
If you're able to go back in time and tell yourself about something about the process, to make it easier, to kind of put yourself at ease, what would you tell yourself at the start of the whole thing?

659
00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:57,000
It's the big one. Please don't.

660
00:45:57,000 --> 00:46:01,000
I mean, there was a lot of fear along the way.

661
00:46:01,000 --> 00:46:07,000
I would say I would go back and tell myself that the movie is gonna turn out great, I think.

662
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:17,000
And then you're gonna like it like because I think there's a lot of self doubt that happens and you're like, who are like, what is this?

663
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:20,000
Is anybody gonna tell what are you doing?

664
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:29,000
Yeah, are we gonna is it worth it? Is it worth the amount of time and our own money that we're putting into this to like see it through?

665
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:45,000
But there is nothing more satisfying than going to see this film play to a packed house. I mean, seeing the film in San Francisco with like a hometown crowd because so many of the women are from the Bay Area was just amazing.

666
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,000
And as a performer's family, I mean, it was so fun.

667
00:46:49,000 --> 00:46:58,000
And the film played like—I mean, it almost—I almost wish we kind of recorded the audience reaction because they were laughing, they were gasping.

668
00:46:58,000 --> 00:47:01,000
And they were cheering. It was like, what is happening?

669
00:47:01,000 --> 00:47:04,000
Did Pickles’ ex show up to the show?

670
00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:05,000
He did not.

671
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:08,000
Oh, okay, good. I was on the edge of my seat for that one.

672
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:13,000
I was like, oh, maybe there's gonna be some action. So I'm like a fight.

673
00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:15,000
Yeah.

674
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,000
That we getcha.

675
00:47:16,000 --> 00:47:17,000
Yeah, I know, right?

676
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:24,000
So then I know that you guys are so working on the distribution model and Rob's a big fan of the indie distribution if you have any questions for him.

677
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:29,000
But I have I'll have no answers, but great. You can ask questions distributing it everyone.

678
00:47:29,000 --> 00:47:30,000
Yeah.

679
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:35,000
I'll do I'll do exactly what I did for my movie. Good luck.

680
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:37,000
So I know somebody through the festival scene.

681
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:45,000
So where can people keep up to date with where Tight & Nerdy is playing and, more importantly, where can we keep up with you two on the interwebs?

682
00:47:45,000 --> 00:47:48,000
Well, I mean, Tight & Nerdy.

683
00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:54,000
You can follow us on Instagram and TikTok and various socials at TightAndNerdyMovie.

684
00:47:54,000 --> 00:47:58,000
We also have a website. Is it TightAndNerdyMovie.com, Jeff?

685
00:47:58,000 --> 00:48:00,000
It is. Jonathan. Thanks for asking.

686
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:06,000
Great. So TightAndNerdyMovie.com, and that has the latest, like, where it’s playing in festivals.

687
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:11,000
We're playing at the Kansas City Film Fest International.

688
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:13,000
Is that the right order of words?

689
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:14,000
Yes.

690
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:21,000
We're playing a couple of festivals in November, which is exciting.

691
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:32,000
And then we're if you follow us on socials, we will be sure to tell you over and over again when you finally can stream the movie somewhere on the interwebs.

692
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:33,000
Someday.

693
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:34,000
Someday.

694
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:39,000
Som... I mean, hopefully within the next ten years.

695
00:48:39,000 --> 00:48:40,000
Ten years.

696
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:41,000
Ten years.

697
00:48:41,000 --> 00:48:46,000
And also, I mean, if you have seen the movie, go review it on Letterboxd.

698
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:47,000
Like our friend Matt did.

699
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:48,000
Oh, thanks, Matt Jackson.

700
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:52,000
I gave it four and a half stars because it's really great.

701
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:54,000
And I tried to write something very nice about it.

702
00:48:54,000 --> 00:48:55,000
You did.

703
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:57,000
Thank you very much. That's always appreciated.

704
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:01,000
So you can add it to your watchlist on Letterboxd for those of you who do that thing.

705
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:02,000
There you go.

706
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:05,000
And then one day it'll be available for you to see.

707
00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,000
And then you'll really be sorry.

708
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:08,000
Yeah.

709
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,000
Or you'll want to dance or get naked.

710
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:11,000
Both.

711
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,000
Or be sorry that you want to dance.

712
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:18,000
Matt, you asked Robb this question earlier, but what Weird Al song are you performing to?

713
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:19,000
Oh, I'm a bad dancer.

714
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:21,000
This is why I asked Rob the question.

715
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:22,000
I don't know.

716
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:24,000
That may not matter.

717
00:49:24,000 --> 00:49:25,000
Yeah.

718
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:26,000
It's a...

719
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:30,000
Oh, actually, I had it stocked and it was...

720
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:31,000
But now I forget what it was.

721
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:32,000
What's the...

722
00:49:32,000 --> 00:49:34,000
It's the money song.

723
00:49:34,000 --> 00:49:35,000
Money for nothing?

724
00:49:35,000 --> 00:49:36,000
No, it's not money for nothing.

725
00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:37,000
It's the other one.

726
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:38,000
It's the original one.

727
00:49:38,000 --> 00:49:40,000
Oh, God, I'm trying to think.

728
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:41,000
Yeah.

729
00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:42,000
It's on...

730
00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:43,000
It's on greatest hit.

731
00:49:43,000 --> 00:49:44,000
It's fine too.

732
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:45,000
Damn it.

733
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:46,000
My dad's on.

734
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:47,000
Oh, Matt is thinking about that drift.

735
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:49,000
Please, please share which song you would perform to.

736
00:49:49,000 --> 00:49:50,000
What?

737
00:49:50,000 --> 00:49:51,000
How dare you?

738
00:49:51,000 --> 00:49:52,000
This is not about us.

739
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:53,000
It's not about you.

740
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:55,000
What is your...

741
00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:57,000
Do you have a favorite Weird Al song?

742
00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:59,000
I love “One of Those Days.”

743
00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:01,000
More than I should.

744
00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:07,000
It's just this deep, kind of original song that just delights me in every sense of the word.

745
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:14,000
So probably that, just a disaster on stage and off, because that's who I am.

746
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:16,000
“This Is the Life.”

747
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:17,000
Oh, yeah.

748
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:18,000
That's great.

749
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:19,000
Oh, yeah.

750
00:50:19,000 --> 00:50:20,000
Isn’t that from Johnny—

751
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:21,000
Was it in Johnny Dangerously?

752
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:22,000
It was, yeah.

753
00:50:22,000 --> 00:50:24,000
I've never seen Johnny Dangerously.

754
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:25,000
You got to watch Johnny Dangerously.

755
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:30,000
Don't we think it holds up?

756
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:31,000
Probably not.

757
00:50:31,000 --> 00:50:34,000
But, man, I loved it when I was younger.

758
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:35,000
It's like Joe Piscopo.

759
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:38,000
Yeah, Joe Piscopo, Michael Keaton.

760
00:50:38,000 --> 00:50:39,000
Right.

761
00:50:39,000 --> 00:50:43,000
I remember it was always in Comedy Central and I would always turn the channel.

762
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:47,000
Okay, so I should bring the show to a close.

763
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:49,000
Yeah, if you want to.

764
00:50:49,000 --> 00:50:50,000
Okay.

765
00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:52,000
All right, and that does it for us.

766
00:50:52,000 --> 00:50:58,000
If you have any questions about filmmaking or movies in general, please email us at IndieFilmLodge@gmail.com.

767
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:01,000
We'd love to hear from you and we may even feature your question on a future show.

768
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:03,000
And in the meantime, tell your friends about us.

769
00:51:03,000 --> 00:51:06,000
And remember, the only thing holding you back is you.

770
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:08,000
So get out there and shoot your feature.

771
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:09,000
I’m Robb and I’m Matt.

772
00:51:09,000 --> 00:51:10,000
We'll see you next time.

773
00:51:10,000 --> 00:51:11,000
Thanks, fellas.

774
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:20,000
[Music]

775
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:22,000
[Music]